Some observations

[John]

Once apon a time I knew nothing about the Philippines. After 8 years
of marriage to a Filipina I now know a little more.

As an example, I now know the USA fought a war with the Philippines
after the Spanish War. Something like 200,000 Filipinos lost their
lives in that war, not to mention about 50,000 American soldiers. I
find it odd that I never heard about that war until after I married a
Filipina. More than odd, really. I think it's scarey. Why is a war the
USA fought so very absent from our kids' history books?

Now we are at war with radical Muslims. I must admit I am worried that
we (the people) aren't getting balanced information about this
struggle.

Now, I have no problem with killing people, even cultures that want to
do the same to us, but I want accurate information before I make my
mind up.

Nowadays things seem to be all about "spin". Maybe things have always
been that way.If you've read "Gulliver's Travels" you'll probably
understand me.

When the Spaniards invaded the Philippines Islam had reached as far
north as Southern Luzon through what is now Indonesia. We know without
question that Filipino tribes that joined the Islamic faith had access
to trade opportunities that would otherwise not have existed for them.
We also know the Islamic faith encourages the killing and enslavement
of those that will not convert.

Then the Spaniards invaded. They eventually installed Christanity over
most of what had been Muslim territory through ruthless intolerance of
any faith except Christianity. The Christian monks sent from Spain
burned all the writings created by native Filipinos (in their own
written language), using the bark "paper" for firewood. In this way
the Spaniards destroyed all of one culture they dominated, and
replaced it with their own.

I ought to stop now, before I reveal my true ignorance. If I've made
any errors I sincerely would like them corrected.

[Ian Graeme]

I guess it depends on where you got your schooling.

I grew up knowing where the phrase "bolo out" came from, and why the
Army rejected the .38 Special and bought the .45ACP instead.

Post by John
Once apon a time I knew nothing about the Philippines. After 8 years
of marriage to a Filipina I now know a little more.
As an example, I now know the USA fought a war with the Philippines
after the Spanish War. Something like 200,000 Filipinos lost their
lives in that war, not to mention about 50,000 American soldiers. I
find it odd that I never heard about that war until after I married a
Filipina. More than odd, really. I think it's scarey. Why is a war the
USA fought so very absent from our kids' history books?
Now we are at war with radical Muslims. I must admit I am worried that
we (the people) aren't getting balanced information about this
struggle.
Now, I have no problem with killing people, even cultures that want to
do the same to us, but I want accurate information before I make my
mind up.
Nowadays things seem to be all about "spin". Maybe things have always
been that way.If you've read "Gulliver's Travels" you'll probably
understand me.
When the Spaniards invaded the Philippines Islam had reached as far
north as Southern Luzon through what is now Indonesia. We know without
question that Filipino tribes that joined the Islamic faith had access
to trade opportunities that would otherwise not have existed for them.
We also know the Islamic faith encourages the killing and enslavement
of those that will not convert.
Then the Spaniards invaded. They eventually installed Christanity over
most of what had been Muslim territory through ruthless intolerance of
any faith except Christianity. The Christian monks sent from Spain
burned all the writings created by native Filipinos (in their own
written language), using the bark "paper" for firewood. In this way
the Spaniards destroyed all of one culture they dominated, and
replaced it with their own.
I ought to stop now, before I reveal my true ignorance. If I've made
any errors I sincerely would like them corrected.

[John]

Post by Ian Graeme
I guess it depends on where you got your schooling.

Very,very true.

Post by Ian Graeme
I grew up knowing where the phrase "bolo out" came from, and why the
Army rejected the .38 Special and bought the .45ACP instead.

How did these facts come to be common knowledge in your community or
household? Was one of your family members of Filipino descent? Or was
one of your forebears involved personally in the Filipino War? These
are important questions, especially considering you seem to have known
these facts from rememberance. I hope you'll tell about it. Something
worthwhile may become known.

Now, I still don't know what "bolo out" means. I don't think I've
heard that phrase even once in my lifetime before now. I'll guess it
doesn't mean something good.

Post by Ian Graeme

Post by John
Once apon a time I knew nothing about the Philippines. After 8 years
of marriage to a Filipina I now know a little more.
As an example, I now know the USA fought a war with the Philippines
after the Spanish War. Something like 200,000 Filipinos lost their
lives in that war, not to mention about 50,000 American soldiers. I
find it odd that I never heard about that war until after I married a
Filipina. More than odd, really. I think it's scarey. Why is a war the
USA fought so very absent from our kids' history books?
Now we are at war with radical Muslims. I must admit I am worried that
we (the people) aren't getting balanced information about this
struggle.
Now, I have no problem with killing people, even cultures that want to
do the same to us, but I want accurate information before I make my
mind up.
Nowadays things seem to be all about "spin". Maybe things have always
been that way.If you've read "Gulliver's Travels" you'll probably
understand me.
When the Spaniards invaded the Philippines Islam had reached as far
north as Southern Luzon through what is now Indonesia. We know without
question that Filipino tribes that joined the Islamic faith had access
to trade opportunities that would otherwise not have existed for them.
We also know the Islamic faith encourages the killing and enslavement
of those that will not convert.
Then the Spaniards invaded. They eventually installed Christanity over
most of what had been Muslim territory through ruthless intolerance of
any faith except Christianity. The Christian monks sent from Spain
burned all the writings created by native Filipinos (in their own
written language), using the bark "paper" for firewood. In this way
the Spaniards destroyed all of one culture they dominated, and
replaced it with their own.
I ought to stop now, before I reveal my true ignorance. If I've made
any errors I sincerely would like them corrected.

[Ian Graeme]

Post by John

Post by Ian Graeme
I guess it depends on where you got your schooling.

Very,very true.

Post by Ian Graeme
I grew up knowing where the phrase "bolo out" came from, and why the
Army rejected the .38 Special and bought the .45ACP instead.

How did these facts come to be common knowledge in your community or
household? Was one of your family members of Filipino descent? Or was
one of your forebears involved personally in the Filipino War?

Nope. In my (public) school, we had history teachers who actually
TAUGHT HISTORY.

These

Post by John
are important questions, especially considering you seem to have known
these facts from rememberance. I hope you'll tell about it. Something
worthwhile may become known.
Now, I still don't know what "bolo out" means. I don't think I've
heard that phrase even once in my lifetime before now. I'll guess it
doesn't mean something good.

"Bolo out" is when an old Marine Corps phrase, meaning that someone
can't shoot -- so, the joke goes, they will take away his rifle and give
him a bolo to slash away with. This joke, and the .45 auto pistol, both
owe their existence to the US military action in the Philippines a
century ago.

For the uneducated among you: the Army had planned to go to the
double-action .38 Special for everyone except Cavalry, but the .38
didn't stop hopped-up Moros. The Single-Action Army ("cowboy pistol")
in .45 Colt did a good job but was slow to use and to reload. John
Browning modified his 1903 pistol to handle a new .45 caliber round, and
the Army went ga-ga over it, which effectively ended military use of the
.38 except for such people as aviators (many of whom carried a small,
very lightweight 5-shot .38).

[amfil]

Post by John
When the Spaniards invaded the Philippines Islam had reached as far
north as Southern Luzon through what is now Indonesia. We know without
question that Filipino tribes that joined the Islamic faith had access
to trade opportunities that would otherwise not have existed for them.
We also know the Islamic faith encourages the killing and enslavement
of those that will not convert.
Then the Spaniards invaded. They eventually installed Christanity over
most of what had been Muslim territory through ruthless intolerance of
any faith except Christianity. The Christian monks sent from Spain
burned all the writings created by native Filipinos (in their own
written language), using the bark "paper" for firewood. In this way
the Spaniards destroyed all of one culture they dominated, and
replaced it with their own.

When the Spanish first appeared in the 1500s, Islam hadn't spread
beyond a (large) number of coastal trading towns - in the Philippines
or elsewhere in Southeast Asia - but not yet to most such towns. Most
people in what's now the Philippines practiced traditional religions
such as animism.

Pre-Hispanic Filipino writings were not lost primarily by active
destruction. In general, no writings anywhere survive long unless
someone sees them as worth copying. Nobody cared. Possibly most of
these Filipino writings would have been ephemeral legal and commercial
documents, and only in those trade centers not dominated by Moslems or
Chinese (who would likely write in non-native languages).

It's worth remembering the small scale of Spanish rule. There were
never more than 400 friars and priests in the Philippines at any one
time. The Spanish had isolated outposts but never really ruled in
most mountain areas and the Mindanao region. I think this is why the
Philippines never became as Hispanized as, e.g., Mexico.

I have found it entertaining to speculate about what would have
happened to the Philippines if the Europeans had never arrived.
Almost surely Luzon would have become mostly Chinese by the same
process which Taiwan went through. Mindanao might have become another
Borneo - Islamic coastal towns engaged in trade and its twin, piracy,
but with no interest in the traditionalist interior.

[John]

Post by amfil
Pre-Hispanic Filipino writings were not lost primarily by active
destruction. In general, no writings anywhere survive long unless
someone sees them as worth copying. Nobody cared. Possibly most of
these Filipino writings would have been ephemeral legal and commercial
documents, and only in those trade centers not dominated by Moslems or
Chinese (who would likely write in non-native languages).
It's worth remembering the small scale of Spanish rule. There were
never more than 400 friars and priests in the Philippines at any one
time. The Spanish had isolated outposts but never really ruled in
most mountain areas and the Mindanao region. I think this is why the
Philippines never became as Hispanized as, e.g., Mexico.
I have found it entertaining to speculate about what would have
happened to the Philippines if the Europeans had never arrived.
Almost surely Luzon would have become mostly Chinese by the same
process which Taiwan went through. Mindanao might have become another
Borneo - Islamic coastal towns engaged in trade and its twin, piracy,
but with no interest in the traditionalist interior.

Interesting post. The monks may not have burned the Filipino documents
with the intent of destroying a culture, but that's what happened. Now
it's impossible to know the old languages and details of what was
before. It's a shame. My understanding of pre-Spanish days is that 98%
of Filipinos were literate in their native languages, while after the
Spanish were there for a while the literacy rate fell to a very low
rate.

Since the Spanish Monks (few as they were) dominated in those areas
where they were in control, and enforced Christianity in those areas,
it can only be assumed that writing in native languages was
discouraged, maybe even punished. Why else did the written language
die out so suddenly?

The Taiwan question is also interesting. You may well be right about
your speculation. One funny thing about Taiwan is that no Chinese I've
spoken with about the subject is even aware that Taiwan was orginally
settled by people of Maylay stock. When I've informed them that the
Maylays migrated out of what is now China I've met with a firm "That's
untrue" as their final argument.

[amfil]

Post by John
Since the Spanish Monks (few as they were) dominated in those areas
where they were in control, and enforced Christianity in those areas,
it can only be assumed that writing in native languages was
discouraged, maybe even punished. Why else did the written language
die out so suddenly?

See Loading Image... for sample
pages from a book on Christian doctrine published by Spanish priests,
using a pre-Hispanic Tagalog script. This suggests to me that the
script took a long time to die, and was accepted by the Spanish.

It is normal for languages and cultures to change. Most historical
writing systems have been abandoned, often in modern times being
replaced by Roman letters on paper just like Tagalog. I don't think
that we have to assume that a script died because someone wanted to
kill it.

Post by John
One funny thing about Taiwan is that no Chinese I've
spoken with about the subject is even aware that Taiwan was orginally
settled by people of Maylay stock. When I've informed them that the
Maylays migrated out of what is now China I've met with a firm "That's
untrue" as their final argument.

interesting and funny!